Wire Wheel Spokes Diameter

[Rob Reilly]

One spoke was missing from one of my wheels, so I got one from Frame Up. I tried to put it in today and discovered it is different from all the rest.
It is .176" diameter, except near the flared and bent end, where it is .206" diameter.
It won't go all the way through the hole in the hub.
All the other spokes on all five wheels are .176 to .178" diameter with no difference at the flared and bent end.
Do I have a wrong spoke? Was there a change in spoke design?
Does anybody know more about this?
These are center laced wheels, stamped X287 inside.

[Duncan M]

I measure .175" everywhere on the unpainted spokes I got from Abingdon Spares years ago. Those look like "upgraded" spokes. Thicker where spokes usually break near the center hub.

Numbers here are real close to standard steel wire gage sizes.
7 steel wire gage is .1770 inch
5 steel wire gage is .2070 inch

[Steve Simmons]

I seem to recall there was a minor change to larger holes in the hubs at some point. I don't recall the details though. The spoke pictured is called "single butted" as opposed to "straight gauge" where it's the same diameter from tip to tip.

It will take me a couple days but I can measure some original TA and TC spokes.

[Charlie Mac Quarrie]

That's a swedged .200 - .175 spoke. These are special non-standard stronger spokes.
Charlie

[Rob Reilly]

Ok thanks. Yes I understand why they would be stronger at the high stress point, more cross sectional area.
It's the long spoke. I wonder if there is more stress on them than on the short spokes?
I sent a question to From the Frame Up. Their catalogue doesn't mention anything about special spokes. I'll wait for them to respond, see if they have a standard one.

[Steve Simmons]

The long spokes take more cornering forces. The short spokes take more road shock. Both are prone to breaking! If I had to say one breaks more than the other, I'd say the long ones break more often.

[Duncan M]

They are called wire wheels because the spokes are made of steel wire.

I recently broke three long spokes on the left rear wheel. A right hand turnoff road came up sooner than expected when I was on a 55mph ish road, and I had to slow and turn right a bit quickly. Did not hear or notice anything until car was in the garage. That wheel is the spare now. Lesson learned.

[Steve Simmons]

Just for info, I've rebuilt all my wheels with single butted spokes. I can still break them, but not nearly as often as the straight gauge. Mike Sherrell was the first to break one of them after the rebuild when I foolishly let him drive my car down a particularly nasty canyon road. I make a terrible passenger, and hearing a front spoke pop didn't help loosen my grip on the Oh Sh*t handle.

I'm also using heavy duty nipples which I kind of regret because they don't look as nice as the originals. Next time I will probably use NOS nipples.

[Rob Reilly]

You guys are starting to scare me. I didn't think broken spokes was all that common an event.
Anyway I talked to Doug at Frame Up and he said all his stock is the same, and if my wheel was in his shop he would open up the hole to fit it. So that is what I will do. I have decimal numbered drill bits. I'll have 1 fat spoke and 239 thin spokes.

[Steve Simmons]

I wouldn't say it's super common. Definitely less common on wheels that don't have 70 year old spokes! And it isn't like the wheel is going to collapse if a spoke or two breaks.

You can get custom spokes made exactly as you want then for less than the retailers sell them for. NOS original spikes are also still available

[frenchblatter]

I remember changing a few spokes on one wheel on mine and there are two lengths, a short and a long. I think I got them from NTG and had no problem fitting them. I used the guitar tuning method of getting them all tensioned, pinging the spokes to get them all playing the same note. After new tyres were fitted they balanced very well.

I don't drive my car on unmade roads and the spokes are fine after 5000 miles.

[Rob Reilly]

Well, the hole was .205" and the spoke was .206", so I used my next size up drill bit which was .209" and that worked. Had to bend the spoke a little bit more to get it aimed over to the place in the rim. I put my Snark LCD guitar tuner on it and tuned it to D sharp which is what most of the others were. A new meaning to the idea of giving you car a tune up.

[Steve Simmons]

The "pinging" method works perfectly well for the most part. I use a thin screwdriver or other thin steel rod. Makes a good ring.

On an old rim, you will always have a few bends and dips and this will require throwing the spokes a bit out of balance in order to get the wheel perfectly straight. The technique of getting the spokes as balanced as possible while getting the rim as straight as possible does take time to learn but it isn't too difficult.

I get plenty of practice, as my rims are original and they aren't exactly treated gently.

[Duncan M]

Flat of a popsicle stick is good for checking for dud spokes.